The Gaian plight - thoughts?

[TheSauron]

This discussion has some weird tones, since it only discusses only about who should the gaians be shooting.
What about the current player faction works? What about the isolated planet Harris, recently filled with activity from planetform players ?( I still don't know what have they been doing there in the past few weeks).

What about the cooperation with the corsairs in the south? What about the mollys? Many things that can be considered about the gaians, before reaching the dull " intervention in the Bret Gaul war " topic.

What about Harris? Well, nothing to do for us there. We have bigger ooRP and inRP worries right now.
Cooperation with Sairs goes well, as usual. Relations with Mollys are neutral. Current faction is GG- and we're in the phase of spinning things up.

On the other hand, the "dull" topic of our involvement on gallic front is actually important, because Gaia, Leeds and Glendale. We are currently forced to ally with someone who endangers the symbol of Gaian cause as well as slaughtered a bit of our people in Lewis. It's like Hogosha would have to ally with Kishiro because reasons just after they forcefully took over Kabukicho.

What happened to the Gaian/Gallic NA Pact?

As far as I know, no one from the Gaian side signed anything. I might be wrong though.

---

One MD Admiral

[jammi]

I'd actually been meaning to post some thoughts of my own about the Gaians and their current situation. My thoughts would be intended as a storyline advancement and not a retcon or replacement though. They also tie in several other plot arcs that are currently ongoing. A brief overview:

Gallia is currently fighting a ground war on Planet Leeds. The current infocards/rumours say they are having difficulty pacifying the Bretonian resistance despite having orbital superiority. This is at least in part due to the fact that Leeds is a hellish mess of underground industrial complexes, tunnels and strategically vital factories that prevent the GRN from simply using their Valors to level everything from above.

Leeds need to be captured relatively intact so the resources there can be used as a forward base to renew their fleet and project force into Liberty. Materiel supply lines from Gallia are too tortuously long to support further expansion. The only reason Bretonia didn't pull all their soldiers out and instead voluntarily trapped their men on the surface (to face almost certain death or capture) was because they understood this. All the time the surface was contested a new space offensive was delayed. But how does this relate to the Gaians?

Well, Gallia can't secure Leeds easily (given how long there's been a stalemate). The Bretonian resistance is also wrecking untold damage through cut and burn retreat tactics. This leaves them with a slight problem with the whole renewed offensive plan. However! There's another easier target that they've got access to. Gaia. Having the Gaians spontaneously turn around and bite the hand that's not smacking them for no reason is a bit silly. There's got to be a pragmatic instigation.

What better reason than the fact that Gallic corporations have just been authorized to begin strip-mining the crown jewel of the Gaians' ideological crusade? Slap an EFL refinery in orbit and update the infocards to describe massed deforestation and mining operations for minerals. Hell, set up a long-running cargo event whereby importing specific goods results in the station growing over time and expanding its services, i.e. repair berths / shipyard skeletons. Give the Gallic corp NPCs in the system their own pilots, and conversely give the Gaians an equal commodity tracking mission to sell however many of those pilots on their own base in the system. Simulates terrorist attacks to make mining Gaia uneconomical.

Naturally, turning on the GRN at this point would likely result in the destruction of Islay. I'd opine that the Gaians would have prepared for that eventuality and set up a new installation somewhere else in Edinburgh in preparation for their first strike. Losing the organisations ancestral home station would be a major blow, but not a fatal one. The fact that their original cause (protecting Gaia) is back in the spotlight after years of aimless drifting would potentially even galvanize the Gaians to new levels of frenzy.

Once this is all in play, the proposed scenario from earlier on in this thread could come into effect. The Gaians become a wildcard, now able to attack either side in the war as situational diplomacy requires. They're also now no longer in the lore-crippling position of being seen as collaborators, when they're nearly entirely reliant on secret donations from the Bretonian public via the Green Front.

Taking up the mantel of wildcard massively increases the desirability of the Gaians due to an expanded number of enemies, and nixes several absurd story points that require an olympic medal in mental gymnastics to justify.

Thoughts?

[TheSauron]

Taking up the mantel of wildcard massively increases the desirability of the Gaians due to an expanded number of enemies, and nixes several absurd story points that require an olympic medal in mental gymnastics to justify.

Thoughts?

I love the last sentence.

I like the idea, only thing I would argue about is the destruction of Islay, as technically inRP it's location is unknown to both Gauls as well as Brets.
The commodity events sound good, I'm pretty sure that this may draw people to both sides (I would love to see corporate warfare there, EFL and GMS vs Gaians. That'd be way better than simply having GRN roll through the area.). Only drawbacks I can think of is the fact that Gaians would have way smaller capacity to kidnap pilots than gallic traders to haul commodities. Also, the battleship near the Lewis JH can prove to be an issue as well, giving gallic side two very convenient and nearby docking spots.

Taking Gaians our of this "lore-crippling" situation is exactly what we're aiming to achieve. Right now I can't really think of anything better than what jamni proposed above.

---

One MD Admiral

[jammi]

I love the last sentence.

I like the idea, only thing I would argue about is the destruction of Islay, as technically inRP it's location is unknown to both Gauls as well as Brets.
The commodity events sound good, I'm pretty sure that this may draw people to both sides (I would love to see corporate warfare there, EFL and GMS vs Gaians. That'd be way better than simply having GRN roll through the area.). Only drawbacks I can think of is the fact that Gaians would have way smaller capacity to kidnap pilots than gallic traders to haul commodities. Also, the battleship near the Lewis JH can prove to be an issue as well, giving gallic side two very convenient and nearby docking spots.

Taking Gaians our of this "lore-crippling" situation is exactly what we're aiming to achieve. Right now I can't really think of anything better than what jamni proposed above.

I aim to entertain.

Personally, I think you'd probably find participation in both events would be fairly level. Gallic corporate activity tends to be fairly lackluster. Although in the faction perks rules, it's mentioned that it's possible to restrict certain commodities so they can only be sold by a certain ID, i.e. a unique commodity to give a specific faction a boost. I'd be inclined to lock delivery tracking so only EFL or other Gallic corp IDs are logged.

Second thoughts about the Gaian side of the mission also suggests that the Gaians would only be able to collect eligible pilot commodities through missions, and those would solely spawn around Gaia and the corporate base. This stops people from simply grinding missions in the arse-end of no-where to anti-social their way to victory. It forces people into interaction zones in order to complete a story-based event mission.

In any case, the idea wouldn't be for the Gallic corps to deliver 1,000,000 units and the Gaians 1,000,000 pilots. The amount each side would have to drop off would be proportionate in effort. Don't know exactly what the conversion figures would be.

As to the battleship? I'd say that makes an extremely good and very symbolic target for a first strike. Replacing it with a wreck and a debris field would be a good place to plop an infocard describing the new relationship between Gallia and the Gaians. Might possibly cut down on "why u shoot?" from confused indies later on.

I'd also be extremely dubious about the Islay point. One of the biggest navies in the history of Sirius is using Edinburgh as a highway to the front line. They'd scour the system until the terrorists that betrayed them were dead. They'd know roughly where they were coming from, given the years of observation. Throwing them a bone by sacrificing Islay would give the Gaians leeway to move elsewhere in the system, seeing as the GRN would wrongly believe the local threat had been neutralized.

[Marburg]

I'd also be extremely dubious about the Islay point. One of the biggest navies in the history of Sirius is using Edinburgh as a highway to the front line. They'd scour the system until the terrorists that betrayed them were dead. They'd know roughly where they were coming from, given the years of observation. Throwing them a bone by sacrificing Islay would give the Gaians leeway to move elsewhere in the system, seeing as the GRN would wrongly believe the local threat had been neutralized.

I'd be on board for sacrificing Islay. There's a station-size rock on the other side of the system within the Arranmore Ice Cloud...once the new station is habitable, the Gaians could solidify an act of revenge against the Gauls by luring a large number of them to Islay Station, allow them to lay siege & then, at the moment of prime opportunity, have the Gaians to remotely blow the station to hell themselves, taking out as many Gauls as possible.

---

[jammi]

Cheers 'Burg. Having the Grandaddy of all Gaians endorse the idea is mucho gratifying.

In any case, I've been putting some thoughts into how this event might work. I think I've stumbled across a solution that would be fantastic to behold, if a technical bitch to create. See below, dear readers, and prepare to rush to make a GMS/EFL/IDF corporate vessel...

1) The new Gallic corporate outpost is placed in orbit of Gaia. This base would produce a commodity called "Gaian Resources", with an infocard that explains how it's a whole variety of minerals stripmined from the verdant jungles of Gaia. By avoiding adding specific mineral commodities, we don't completely destroy local trade balance. Bretonia's a net importer of many of them, after all.

2) This commodity is exclusively ID locked to EFL/GMS/IDF, the Gallic corporate groups. It sells for ludicrous sums in Rambouilette Shipyard in Il de France - think ore during a cargo buff event. Deliveries of Gaian Resources to Rambouilette are tracked and are how a win condition is achieved for the Gallic corps.

3) There is only a limited amount of Gaian Resources for sale - the outpost generates it at a steady rate, so it is possible to run out. It is also capped at a max amount, perhaps 40k initially, to stop a massive stockpile accruing during periods of low activity.

4) The rate at which the commodity regenerates, and the maximum cap that can be stored may be increased by the relevant folks shipping relevant goods to the station. Gallic mining machines could increase the regen, while Gallic construction machinery could increase the cap. The current stock and cap would be listed in the InfoCard. You may recognize this as an NPC base that has many of the attributes of a PoB - one that's invincible and doesn't need any upkeep to survive.

5) The rate at which the commodity is generated may also be reduced by the Gaians, by taking missions against the Gallic corporate groups in Edinburgh. These missions will spawn relatively close to Gaia and the outpost. The ships in these missions drop a special Gallic corporate pilot that may be sold on their base in order to lower the commodity regen.

6) A snub-only Gaian docking satellite could also be added to Gaia, similar to the one on Leeds. Delivering Black Market Munitions would also serve to lower Gaian Resources regeneration rate (Gaian guerrillas on the surface attacking mining operations).

So, what are the direct effects of this proposal? Gallic corporate factions hopefully receive a surge in interest, with a hyper-lucrative route going from Edinburgh and preferably through the Taus to Gallic core space. A whole lot of groups could benefit from this. The Gaians also gain three sources of activity, in the form of specific missions, a smuggling point and the ability to interdict players shipping to and from the Gaia outpost.

2am powertrading is also potentially limited, seeing as the max stock of Gaian Resources would be capped. Only so much could be shifted before the stock runs out and they have to do something else. The Gaian smuggling point would also be easy to balance, given that it could copy many of the prices set for the Leeds point one system over.

The event could run for either four months or a full mod version, with the 'winner' (either Gallic corps hit their quota of exported minerals, or they lose) impacting the direction of the next mod's storyline. This would basically be a first for Discovery - a major plot point that emphasizes the importance of logistics in military endeavors, and allows for corporate influence instead of the war being decided solely by whoever flexes the most battledicks at one another.

---

News article library, feedback and content requests.

[Jazzi]

Jammi,

I think you're a Genius. An event like this is an innovative way of kick starting some activity in an otherwise locked-in system and aligning player incentives with story development. If we could get backing from the Dev's on this it would be great not only within the boundaries we are discussing, but also as a test-bed for possibilities in the future. We've already seen from recent events how integrated into game mechanics one off events can be. Imagine:

For the locked ID's (or perhaps those who subscribe to it via a console command?), mission status updates could appear periodically concerning the amount that is left at the station or how much has been shipped in total. This could be hourly, and be statements or descriptions giving an idea of the balance of power during the event.

In addition, the idea of BMM smuggling into Gaia is an intriguing prospect. Whilst there are a number of trade routes Gaian's can run, they usually involve other factions goods and feel detached from RP purposes. Aye, I konw Islay imports BMM's but who are the people on Islay fighting at the moment?) This is a great way of bringing the two together.

---

---

C47 - Origins | C47 - Operational Database

---

[Highland Laddie]

Quick question: why is the automatic assumption here that turning Gaians against Gallia results in the inevitable destruction of Islay? Isn't it a secrecy base hidden in a gas cloud....just like many other hidden bases all over Sirius. If this base is so obvious a target....how did it manage to exist for all that time without getting killed by the BAF? Or the Mollies? Or anyone else? What makes Gallia so much more knowledgeable about its location that it would be vulnerable (Junker Intel?)?

Otherwise, I have no problem with the scenario Jammi described.

[Marburg]

well, you know how comic book logic works. A single pair of glasses can hide the identity of Superman & women w/ freakishly big bresteses & high heels can kung-f u like magic ect, ect. It's ridiculous, but it's just a given & accepted. Same logic applies to hidden bases. It's ridiculous, but also generally a given.

Just sayin' but personally, I don't give a squirty brown squat either way if people wanna assume the Gauls know where Islay is or not...but the more I think about it, (since IC, all my gaian characters hate the gauls for the slaughter of Lewis) the more I love the idea of shoving hot chunks of Islay so far up Gallic butt that they choke & burn in sweet retaliation.

---

[TheSauron]

This would basically be a first for Discovery - a major plot point that emphasizes the importance of logistics in military endeavors, and allows for corporate influence instead of the war being decided solely by whoever flexes the most battledicks at one another.

And yet again the last sentence didn't failed me.

I'm pretty sure that this would indeed be a hell to code, but on the other hand, this would be so damn awesome. If we're to go by proportional amounts of commodities/pilots, then I'm all for it.

As a side note, wasn't there such a logistic event on Rheinland-Liberty front?

Quick question: why is the automatic assumption here that turning Gaians against Gallia results in the inevitable destruction of Islay? Isn't it a secrecy base hidden in a gas cloud....just like many other hidden bases all over Sirius. If this base is so obvious a target....how did it manage to exist for all that time without getting killed by the BAF? Or the Mollies? Or anyone else? What makes Gallia so much more knowledgeable about its location that it would be vulnerable (Junker Intel?)?

Otherwise, I have no problem with the scenario Jammi described.

That's exactly my concern. If Islay remained hidden from BAF for decades, why would GRN find it in a matter of few years?

---

One MD Admiral