snub powercores

[Ursus]

LFs and HFs are already slightly worse off than VHFs in that they can only mount lower-class weapons. A typical VHF has 2x Class 9s and 4x Class 10s. An HF has 2x Class 8s and 4x Class 9s. A LF has 2x Class 8s and 2x Class 9s. This already makes a significant difference in the damage output of these smaller fighters.

But on top of that, we have powercores that can't even keep up with these lower-class guns in the same way that a VHF's powercore can keep up with its higher-class guns. As far as drawbacks go, this seems rather redundant when smaller fighters are already limited in the class of weapons they can mount.

This is pretty much my thinking too. Lots of ways to break them into classes, but right now the lesser fighters are segregated by all of them. Hull strength, bats/bots, hardpoints, weapon class, power core, ... It just seems that if the power plant output was nudged so that they could fire the weapons that they can mount, they would become much more useful. They would still have fewer weapons of a lower class, weak hulls, and all the rest of the nerfs.

Extremely irritating to take the hit for a smaller fighter, negotiate the ship into position and then only have 5 second shot time while the enemy is boxing and running. VHF might not be able to get behind as easily but it can hold the button down when it does.

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Discovery 24/7 Negotiating Tactics:

[Curios]

don't put all 6 in one group? a 4x group of stock weapons can be fired indefinitely by most of them, not true for HF, and LF is a different story altogether

Don't put all guns on LF, put 1, you will be able to fire for a long time.

Problem solved.

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[dodike]

Don't put all guns on LF, put 1, you will be able to fire for a long time.

Problem solved.

/thread

[AeternusDoleo]

Please tell me what VHFs you have been flying. Any VHF mounting six class9 guns will run out of energy fairly quickly if firing constantly.

'Xept for the Werewolf on the improved efficiency Sammies. They can keep firing all 6 of em into infinity almost... But then again, the Werewolf is practically an SHF.

As for LFs. If you're running into a power crisis, mount some missiles.

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Wide awake in a world that sleeps, enduring thoughts, enduring scenes. The knowledge of what is yet to come.
From a time when all seems lost, from a dead man to a world, without restraint, unafraid and free.

Mostly retired Discovery member. May still visit from time to time.

[Benchee]

This definitely would overpower LFs. Especially those which can use MRs.
Currently Loki has 8,000u poweroutput, MR takes 6,400u energy per shot.

Do you really want to buff energy of LFs so they can MR even more?

All Light Fighters got 850/8500 poweroutput since 486. That actually does make a big difference, as thats almost as much as a standard Heavy Fighter, while only having 4 possible guns to support.

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[Jihadjoe]

don't put all 6 in one group? a 4x group of stock weapons can be fired indefinitely by most of them, not true for HF, and LF is a different story altogether

Heavy Flashpoint - energy used per second: 458
4x Heavy Flashpoint - energy used per second: 1,832

Sabre power recharge per second: 1,160
Sabre powerplant size: 11,400

That leaves a shortfall of 672 energy regen per second.

A sabre powerplant (medium sized VHF plant) will be drained by four flashpoints firing constantly in just a shade under 17 seconds.

The majority of class 9 weapons use significantly more energy per second than heavy flashpoints.

So essentially, what are you talking about?

I mean, an eagle VHF with four black widows will run out of juice in a little over six seconds of constant firing. That's a pretty standard loadout for a xeno eagle.

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[casero]

I remember using a chimaera with 3 debs and 3 Sunfrenzies. Using one group per time gave me a lot of constant fire. And debs consumed a lot more than the Sunfrenzies. But it was just 3 guns doing damage, using an extra fourth gun unbalanced that recharge badly.


Also, do the same with your heavy fighters, mount adv. debs and class 8 Flashpoints.

[Jihadjoe]

Or just practice good energy management. Work on aim and positioning (putting yourself in places where you're far more likely to hit the target), and you'll find you use less energy for greater damage, as you hit more frequently.

You'll find you can get into a good position in a fight more easily with the added speed of a heavy fighter, thus counterbalancing the smaller plant. However due to the low armour, making a mistake is more costly.

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[Ursus]

So essentially, what are you talking about?

I should not have said indefinite, although it's practically the same. Anything approaching or exceeding 20 seconds of holding down the button is basically the same thing when you're running somebody down.

There is also the point that Class-10 are available to VHF but not available to HF, and those are more effecient. You can absolutely make a setup there that lets you hold the button down forever. I've done it, don't recall the mix exactly but I know it's possible.

I'm sure there are examples good and bad (like the Black Widow) but that is a corner case, and I am trying to talk about the general issue here. The point I am struggling to make is that the primary offensive advantage of being able to run down an enemy ship is made moot by the inability to sustain fire on the target.

However now that I've thought about it a little more, it may be that the core problem is with the energy consumption of the weapons. Maybe access to clsass-10 is the real advantage, rather than the powercore size. If so then it becomes much harder to give HF the ability to run down the target.

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Discovery 24/7 Negotiating Tactics:

[Govedo13]

Mounting 4 class 10 guns on HF will make it OP if it is with standard HF agility/size. Look at the Gladiator- it was with 4 class 10 guns and it was nerfed with 2 class 9 and 2 class 10, as someone stated - Gladiator turns a bit slower then Manta.
The PvP in disco is based of doing dmg while you take less/none, smaller ships with greater agility boasting tons of DPS would win in every situation - so nobody will fly VHFs.
All codes lost their good efficiency in 4.86 too- all were energy nerfed, 650 ones get also distance nerfed.

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Official faction players that are often accused of elitism, never deploy them and have those weird, immersion killing "fair fight/dueling" suicidal hobbies. (yes, i've seen enough of those lolduels, where house military with overwhelming force on the field willingly loses a pilot in a duel. ffs.)